Post by Phoenix Suns on Jun 25, 2022 19:36:21 GMT -6
Welcome to the seventh edition of the Guru Gazette!
I am your
Thanks to the Wizards, Bucks, Pelicans, and Kings for participating!
Bucks: Pleasure to be here!
Pelicans: Thanks for having me.
Kings: No problem!
Wizards: INCOMING HOT TAKES FROM THE WIZARDING WORLD!
Sounds sexy. Like this?
Wizards: No, more like this:
Unfortunate.
Let's get started...
Dame Lillard just tweeted this. Give me 3 teams and what packages they would have to put together to get Kevin Durant's 4 year guaranteed contract (with no options).
Pelicans: Let's see...
A. Portland: I don’t like any of the available options for BKN tbh. But here’s my best shot at this one: Grant (I’m assuming he can be traded already), Bledsoe, Simmons, Little, and like every pick they can possibly trade. It would be a long winter in Brooklyn…
Winter is Coming.
Pelicans: LOL. Moving on:
B. Washington: the package would center around Porzingis, Kuzma, Deni, Rui + filler and picks. Bring KD back home. Him + Beal would be a pretty formidable eastern conference powerhouse. And this arrangement gives Brooklyn some flexibility in how to move forward.
C. Memphis: Adams, Z Williams, D Brooks, B Clarke, and anything else not named Ja, Jaren, or Desmond…. If they could pull this off without giving up Bane, they may immediately become Western conference favorites. I imagine they'd have to lose Bane too, but even still this would be such an amazing team. Also, the rivalry with GSW would be the most exciting thing in the NBA on day 1.
That would be a fun as hell timeline. The WCF would be LIT.
Bucks: That does sound fun, but I'll cover some different teams for the sake of the discusssion.
A. Boston : Jaylen Brown + Derrick White + 2 1sts?
B. Raptors : OG Anunoby + Paskal Siakam for Durant + Claxton
Aaaand my favourite one:
C. Lakers: THT + 2nd
That's some Guru Suns/Anonymous Eastern Conference Exec THT valuation right there, I like it
Bucks: Guru Raps is not amused.
Wizards: Here we go!
A. Nuggets - MPJ + picks + salary to match
B. Trail Blazers - ton of picks + salary to match + maybe like a Josh Hart
Underrated sleeper to me would be:
C. Pelicans, who have lots of young players and draft capital they could ship off to Brooklyn. KD + Ingram + McCollum + Zion would be dangerous
Not as dangerous as opening a Golden Corral All-You-Can-Eat-Buffet within 10 miles of Zion's house.
Kings: I had the same idea as Bucks with regards to the Celtics:
A. Boston -- Derrick White + Jaylen Brown
B. Phoenix -- Chris Paul + Jae Crowder + future picks
C. Chicago -- Lonzo Ball + Demar Derozan + Patrick Williams for KD and Joe Harris
The issue with this era of trade requests is that there’s only so many teams that have the assets and willingness to put together these monster packages (smirk). If Kyrie is gone, that’s one fewer team like that left. I’d like to see him stick on the Nets and work with Sean Marks to put a team around him. They’re really only a lead ball-handler away from being a very good playoff team (if Ben Simmons is healthy).
Fair. People are quick to forget the Nets were a toe away from knocking out the champs just a year ago, and that was without Kyrie and an injured Harden.
Kings: Exactly.
Would you take Jaden Ivey at #4 in the Guru Draft? Is he a lock at that spot?
Bucks: I would and I will, I love his landing spot in Detroit and there is a huge drop-off after that.
Wizards: I would take him at #3 in the Guru Draft. While I do think Jabari Smith is an excellent jumpshooter, I don't think his game is versatile enough to where he can take that superstar leap. Ivey, on the other hand, is a super explosive athlete whose jumper finally came around last season to complete his offensive game.
Whoa. That is a HOT take.
Pelicans: Yes. Yes.
Kings: If Ivey is available at 4, yes. I would presume Bucks is eyeing him there. I’m a fan of him and like the situation in Detroit with Cade and a couple other complementary pieces. Keegan is probably a safe bet to be fantasy relevant, but doesn’t have much upside.
Where does Steph Curry rank for you all-time after his 4th championship?
Bill Simmons moved him up from #16 into his Top 10, as have many others.
"Simmons lists Moses Malone, Shaquille O’Neal, Hakeem Olajuwon, Oscar Robertson, Jerry West … and Kevin Durant as the six players Steph has surpassed in his mind."
A typical Top 25 list:
1. MJ
2. LeBron
3. Kareem
4. Russell
5. Magic
6. Wilt
7. Bird
8. Duncan
9. Shaq
10. Kobe
11. Hakeem
12. Oscar
13. West
14. KD
15. Curry
16. Dr. J
17. Moses Malone
18. Karl Malone
19. Barkley
20. Dirk
21. Baylor
22. Garnett
23. Robinson
24. Giannis
25. Isiah
Bucks: Ooof ranking all type players is so hard for me cause I havent watched old film as much. I am going to put them in no particular order:
MJ-Lebron-Kareem-Russell(westbrook ofc)-Kobe-Hakeem-Shaq-Magic-Wilt-Curry
I guess I am leaving out Bird and Duncan on that list but it is honestly a torture ranking those so I am going to move on swiftly
Wizards: I have him around 9 or 10 on my list now.
My top 10 is as follows: Jordan, Bron, Kareem, Magic, Duncan, Bird, Wilt, Shaq, Curry, Kobe - Curry and Kobe are essentially interchangeable to me.
4 rings + finals mvp + only unanimous regular season mvp + all-time leader in threes by a wide margin (once he retires) + literally revolutionized the game of basketball is a top 10 resume, in my opinion.
Bill Russell after hearing Wizards left him out of his Top 10:
Absolutely disgusting.
Pelicans: Probably right around the bottom of the top 10…. His accolades compare pretty well to guys in that range. But more importantly, the “changed the game” argument is just so undeniable.
Agreed.
Kings: I’d probably put him 10 and move Wilt to 11 and Hakeem into the top 10, probably at 9. It was super important for his legacy to win this finals later in his career as the clear best player on the team.
Who won the Wizards/Suns trade in Guru?
Bucks: It is one of those situations that Suns was never going to be getting the value that Shai was worth cause everyone knew he had his hand forced. I think it is alright value and an underrated salary dump of Tobias. Knowing Suns I am sure he shopped Shai around even if it feels really early to trade him he must have contacted some suitors (even though he never responded to me, rip) I wish at least one of those first were a good one on its own so he wouldn't have to package them together to move up next year since I haven't seen this happening very often with top 5 picks.
Wizards: I plead the fifth.
Move it along to the next topic!
Pelicans: I like it for both. Hard to say who wins a talent-for-future-assets trade at this stage. I think SGA will be a superstar for years to come, so one of those picks better really pay. I do trust Suns to draft tho.
Kings: Given the re–sign circumstances I think Suns wins slightly. Getting four firsts for any player is an impressive return, and Wizards should have had all of the leverage. I still like it for Wizards, though, especially since consolidating assets is such a difficult thing to accomplish without losing too much value.
Kings said something nice about me!
How generational is the 2023 NBA Rookie Draft? Is Victor Wembanyama truly a Lebron-level prospect?
Bucks: Oh I don't know much about 2023, people say it is good but I have seen so many in the former top 5-7 of the draft becoming 2nd round projections so we'll see. Victor must be insane I haven't heard so much hype since Wiggins I believe? We gonna see some hard IRL and Guru tanking next year.
Ouf, that's some draft boner killing name-dropping right there.
Bucks: Consider yourself lucky I didn't mention Anthony Bennett
What say ye, Spellcaster?
Wizards: Let me put it to you this way: Victor Wembanyama was if Kevin Durant was five inches taller and had Rudy Gobert's defensive skills. The talent difference between him and a guy like Chet Holmgren was so obvious in the FIBA U19 World Cup - Wemby dominated the US in that finals game. His main flaw, like many who hit a major growth spurt as early as he did, will be his health, as he suffered several injuries this past season, including a season-ender. Outside of him, Scoot Henderson from the G-League Ignite is a bonafide franchise PG (Wizards, pay attention) and there's still the usual crop of high schoolers that will emerge as lotto picks during the college season. It really is a strong, deep draft - probably the best in at least the last three years.
The IRL Wizards scouting department:
Wizards: Accurate.
Pelicans: Miss me with any talk about “Lebron-level” until we see another dude who lived the Lebron life from early teens on then maintained this level of competitive play for 20 years. I wont bet on anyone to match the latter, and there may never be another who experiences the former.
Kings: I’ve only seen highlights of Wemby but having listened to some other people who I trust he seems a bit overrated. I think he’ll probably be closer to an AD or Wiggins level prospect; still great, but not generational (using the real definition of that word). The 2023 class has about 20 players that would probably be in the top 10 of this year’s class, so it should be an exciting year to see who can really increase their stock, especially given the varied situations the top prospects are in (international, G League, OTE).
Oh shit, comparing Andrew Wiggins to Anthony Davis... you pissed AD off now:
Pelicans: What's funny is AD and the muppet both have the same bone density.
What are the odds Kyrie Irving ends up on the Lakers? Should the Nets blow it up?
Bucks: Blowing it up would be a disaster unless they get back a franchise type player along with crazy amount of draft picks. Irving is the only star in this league that I would give him possibilities to play for a MLE cause he is just that crazy but damn that would be veto worthy by the league (if you can veto signings and not only trades I got no idea)
I don't think the league can veto trades? They killed the Chris Paul trade because they were running the team at the time.
Wizards: The Lakers are both desperate and stupid, which is a perfect recipe for adding Kyrie Irving to your basketball team. I can't wait to see the mess that creates over there. If Kyrie leaves, it's pretty much a foregone conclusion that KD is also leaving, so the Nets will probably have to "blow it up" out of necessity rather than by choice. They've shown the ability to recoup assets and build through the draft in the past though, and Sean Marks is a solid GM, so I trust him with a rebuild.
Pelicans: Very low. I don’t understand this discussion. Yeah, the Nets should probably blow it up. What's the alternative? They can't win with this roster and its hard to imagine how they significantly improve it.
Not sure I agree. They almost won with KD and Harden's mangled corpse. If we get another KD 2021 playoff run with a healthy Ben Simmons and Kyrie Irving and Joe Harris, they could win.
Pelicans: Agree to disagree.
Kings: I dunno, I guess it makes some sense for him to reunite with LeBron. Probably my first pick if I had to predict where he’s going. The last thing Brooklyn wants is to have to trade both of them to teams that know they have to, so maybe trying to preempt that situation by starting talks early could be beneficial.
The Nets shouldn’t blow it up, but if Kyrie leaves it does seem more likely that it's the domino that starts the fall, and KD follows and requests out.
Kyrie be like:
Do you like the IRL Mavs trade for Christian Wood? Do they have to re-sign Jalen Brunson, and does it push them a tier higher next year?
Bucks: I do actually like it, it is not like they gave up much it is worth a shot. I think Wood is an OK player and even if it is a 1 year rental it still improves their chances of being good for sure. Unfortunately with how the NBA salary stuff is constructed atm you kinda have to give mediocre players insane contracts in this day and age. I would probably be looking to trade him though cause I dont think Brunson is a player that can justify 100m for 4 years. I don't believe in the Mavs as much cause their bench played insane in this playoffs run while I dont see them as particularly good players to justify a similar performance next year.
Kings: Yes, I like the trade. Wood is pretty overrated, but he should help them offensively. Brunson should definitely be their top priority in the offseason – he’s their second best player and super important offensively. I like the idea of them pursuing Mitchell Robinson, but he seems unlikely to leave New York.
Wizards: I think the Rockets could've gotten more in return for Wood, but I'm not sure how much more. Getting only one late first round pick and a bunch of role players is a bit disappointing for a solid player who's still only 26 years old, but I think the Rockets committed to moving him and simply chose the best offer on the table for him rather than waiting or negotiating. The Mavs will do whatever Luka tells them to do, so if he wants Brunson back, he'll be back.
Pelicans: I think the Wood trade makes sense for them. I just don’t understand how they’re going to defend. I think they have to resign Brunson. Even if its just to shop him.
Mark Cuban right now:
[Jake Fischer] Atlanta has shown interest in trading John Collins to the Indiana Pacers for Malcolm Brogdon
Would you do this for either team?
Bucks: Who the hell knows what the Pacers want to do but I believe they win this trade value-wise and as a rebuilding team it would make sense. The hawks really need a backup PG but giving up your starting 24yo PF for that is not ideal unless their hand is forced. I would do it to unless the beast that is called Jalen Johnson though!
Bucks: Haha, agreed.
Wise nerds?
Wizards: It doesn't make either team particularly better, but the Hawks have been publicly shopping Collins around for so long that any hope of reconciliation between the two parties is forever ruined. As a UVA graduate and proud owner of a Malcolm Brogdon Pacers jersey, this deal would sadden me, but Collins needs to get the hell out of Atlanta asap and go somewhere that appreciates his skillset.
Preach!
Pelicans: I don’t really like it for either team. Not a big fan of the Collins-Turner frontcourt. Its eerily reminiscent of the one they just blew up. And, although ATL needs a creator behind TY, I’m not a huge fan of Brogdon—who is often hurt—especially if he isn’t the primary guard on the ball.
Kings: Yes, for Indiana. Brogdon is barely a positive asset given his injuries and Collins could fit nicely on a team looking to fill in some holes with young pieces. Atlanta should be able to get more for him.
In Guru, what do you think of Philly trading his LAC 2023 pick to move up ONE SPOT (from #2 to #1) in the 2022 Rookie Draft?
Bucks: I like it! Clippers has shown that they always want to be competitive so I don't expect them to tank at all. If you believe in a guy I think a mediocre pick is an ok price to pay. Chet has clearly the best fantasy profile of all 4 top guys and if we assume none of them are busts ( which is unlikely ofc) he should be the top performer so why not!
Bruh, have you seen the Clippers roster? That pick could end up becoming Victor Wembanyama:
Wizards: When your favorite organization drafts an athletic 7 foot spaghetti noodle with a top 3 pick, you do anything and everything in your power to get him on your dynasty team. Seriously though, I don't mind it - Philly gave up something like the 10th pick next year in order to secure the player who he thinks will be a cornerstone for his franchise, I'm fine with it.
Again, have you guys seen LAC's team?
Pelicans: I think theres a decent chance he could have got his Chet at 2. Am I wrong, SAC?
Kings: You're not wrong.
Slightly biased, but I’m a fan. OKC seemed locked in on Chet, and even though they’ve successfully executed smokescreens in the past this one seemed a bit more certain given they were drafting so high (obviously Philly was just going to draft whomever Presti took). Chet’s great for fantasy but I always had my eyes on Paolo. Philly, like Presti, has too many picks to actually use, so making these trades to secure their target is still a good decision, just one that can be a bit painful in a vacuum.
What do the Suns do with Ayton in the real NBA?
Bucks: I do agree that Ayton is not worth a max or close to a max contract. But as i said for Brunson, what can you really do? You are a championship contender no doubt and even if you let him you wont have cap space for much. You can't afford to make your team worse so you just pay him and pray you can trade him to someone who believes in him. I said it before and I will say it again, Ayton will get exposed when CP3 retires, he is one of the (if not the) worst starter at creating ANYTHING for himself.
Wizards: Much like John Collins, I don't think they'll have much say in the matter. Declining to offer Ayton the max likely alienated him from ever playing for a Robert Sarver-owned team again, and I would expect that he would either hold out or ask for a trade should they somehow bring him back next year. If they're not willing to offer Ayton what he wants, there's probably some other desperate team out there (I'm looking at you, Detroit) who will, and they'll have no choice but to let him go.
Wizards taking shots at Detroit.
Pelotons?
Pelicans: Match his offer sheet. Who are we kidding? They can’t let him walk. They’ll always be able to trade him for more than nothing.
Kings: Hoping for a sign-and-trade seems to be their best bet. Getting fair value in those is usually impossible, but getting something back is important. Off the top of my head, I’m not too sure where his plausible destinations are but I’m sure Phoenix already has some ideas.
Agreed.
Which of the following players would you re-sign in Guru?
Jonathan Isaac (Wizards)
Kevin Huerter (Raptors)
DeMar Derozan (Raptors)
Christian Wood (Blazers)
Russell Westbrook (Clippers)
Bucks: Oof those are not great options huh. Probably only derozan for 2+1 years? and pray he stays healthy. Hurter hell no, Isaac is obviously a huge mystery box but I am not a huge fan and I don't even know how you resign a player who hasn't played? If it is for 3m as a minimum it is an interesting way to scam the system if you believe in him.
Wood's value should drop so might as well do after him in FA imo.
Wizards: Is Kevin Huerter even that good in dynasty? This is news to me. DeMar is probably worth a re-sign, he had one of the best seasons of his career in 2021-22 and is still only 32 - I expect he has a few more good years left. I'm not keeping Westbrook around, that situation in LA is too volatile and he's pushing 35. I would keep Wood around too if I was Portland, 26 and locked into a productive role in Dallas. That would leave his third re-sign for Trae, and I don't see anyone else on his squad whose contract would expire before the refresh.
Pelicans: Hmm...
Jonathan Isaac – this seems hard to justify… does he still play? How do you even determine his salary at this point? Also ACAB…
Kevin Huerter – I wouldn’t burn 1/3 on him
DeMar Derozan – probably not, but looks like POR has the re-signs to burn so I wouldn’t hate it
Christian Wood – not for me
Russell Westbrook – lol id probably do it just out of loyalty. Good thing I don’t have him.
Kings: Isaac I would re-sign if I had any confidence he sees himself as a basketball player rather than a political idiot figure. Huerter is just a role player – I wouldn’t be interested in keeping that at above-market value. Derozan is old and unlikely to replicate this last season so that seems like a bad recipe for a re-sign. Wood, despite some issues on Houston, had a fairly productive season, but would still be my first choice here. He should be plenty involved in the Dallas offense and is a pretty safe bet to contribute for a while longer. Russ’ triple double days seem to be long behind him, and though he’s still great for fantasy I’d be scared of him taking on an even smaller role on a team than he has now.
Everyone seems to be out on Huerter and Westbrick. I'd have to concur.
Here is a safe space for you to Apologize to Andrew "Maple Jordan" Wiggins.
I personally would like to say I'm sorry, you were the 2nd best player in an NBA Finals and made Tatum look like Josh Jackson. I was wrong.
Bucks: Mr. Canadian Jordan thank you for giving a chip to my 2nd favourite team in the nba. You made like 100m early in your career while being mediocre at best so it is hard for me to feel bad for all you have heard. But to be fair you did play for the team that passed on Curry TWICE, how fun would that have been...
Wizards: Dearest Andrew, I must admit, I laughed when the Warriors took on your massive contract in exchange for D'Angelo Russell. I thought for sure that, besides the first rounder they also sent to Golden State, Minnesota got the better end of the deal. Boy, was I wrong. What a playoff run you had, and I can't wait to see what the future holds for you.
Pelicans: I always knew he had this in him
Kings: It’s too bad we don’t have any Wolves fans to really put together something heartfelt. As a neutral, I’m happy to see him find his niche. The Warriors seem to be the clear best team for players to find their optimal role.
How neutral of you. I'm disgusted.
Well that concludes our panel. Let's end with some final thoughts.
Any words for our viewers?
Pelicans: Yes: box, toaster, aluminum, maple syrup- no I take that one back. I'm gonna hold on to that one.
Wizards: Thanks for foolishly handing me a top 10 fantasy asset who's only 23 years old and will power my franchise for the next ten years, idiot!
Props to the Pelicans, Wizards, Kings, and Bucks for their quick responses!
Good luck to everyone in the draft!